A few years ago, I visited Destiny Church in my hometown of Rotorua. It was my sister’s church and definitely not my cup of tea. I was a critic. But I couldn’t deny the positive impact of the church in her life.
I’ve never been a great fan of Brian Tamaki, either, but I’ve been astounded by the outpouring of hatred and vitriol towards “the Bishop” over the past few weeks.
While there are valid questions over some of his theological views on homosexuality, the media attention (29 articles in the Herald alone), social media outcry, and online petition to strip the church of its tax-free status, has seemed disproportionate and unfair to me.
And it has obscured what Destiny is really about — an indigenous-led church that’s helping Māori families turn their lives around.
But a balanced discussion seems to have been drowned out by the simplistic accusation of gay hatred. Tamaki’s own defence — that he doesn’t hate gays, has good friends who are gay, and that they are welcome in his church — fell on deaf ears. As did Hannah Tamaki’s tweet: “I have gay family & friends … I tell them I love them.”
Even the public endorsement of an openly gay friend did little to calm the storm. Jevan Goulter told the New Zealand Herald: “I respect him as a person, I disagree with his view but I’m not going to write off the 35 years of work he has done with the people in his community or null and void a friendship.”
Peter Lineham, an associate professor of history at Massey University who wrote about Destiny in his 2013 book Destiny: The Life and Times of a Self-made Apostle, has a more nuanced view than most. He’s also gay — and told Stuff that, while pleasant to deal with on a personal level, Brian Tamaki maintains a Bible-based judgment of homosexuality. “He’s perfectly courteous and accepting of individuals, but disapproves of gay people as a whole on principle.”
Brian Tamaki is hardly alone in viewing homosexuality as a sin. In fact, among those who hold to the belief that the Bible is the literal word of God — including Pentecostalists and other conservative Christians in mainline churches — it’s a fairly standard view. Many conservative Jews and Muslims also hold this position.
And yet, as far as I know, no one is campaigning to revoke the tax-exempt status of any other church with this view.
The other issue that caused an outcry is the perception that Brian Tamaki has made himself wealthy at the expense of his poor congregants. I don’t know the state of Tamaki’s bank account, so it’s hard to know how true this is, but I do wonder why other wealthy tithe-teaching Pentecostal preachers don’t receive the same opprobrium.
A cursory survey of Destiny accounts reveals that the amounts involved are relatively modest. The largest of their churches in Auckland had a total gross income of $2,204,742 in 2015, which covered the wages of 23 full-time employees and six part-timers, plus all operations. By comparison, another Auckland Pentecostal church, City Impact, had a total gross income of $15,293,828 in the same year, with 66 full-time workers and 65 part-time workers.
Sure, Tamaki has invited controversy through actions like the anti-civil union “Enough is Enough” march to parliament, and the false prophesy of ruling New Zealand. And many also consider him a cult leader. But, while certainly audacious, Tamaki is not the first self-styled Māori prophetic type to fall foul of mainstream consensus. Nor is he the first to lead a large congregation of predominantly Māori followers.
As Peter Lineham has written: “Destiny stands in the tradition of Māori religious movements, including Ringatū, Ratana and many smaller groups … In this tradition indigenous churches are motivated by a vision for the future of the Māori people; this vision combines religion and politics and is committed to transforming the condition of Māori people. Such churches are profoundly concerned at the depravity and decline of the Māori community.”
Destiny members have been caricatured as poor, ignorant victims. But no one is forced to attend the church. It seems to me that they attend (and pay their tithes) because there’s something in it for them. They like the aspirational message: that they don’t have to stay in the brown poverty box. That they can reach for something more, just as their leaders have done.
For many Māori, Destiny Church feels culturally comfortable. The vibe is Māori-friendly — it’s relaxed, happy, upbeat, “whānau, whānau”. The music is great: it’s like attending a rock concert. There’s a feeling of belonging. And the respect shown towards leaders is also culturally comfortable. In fact, the payment of a tithe is not that different from the obligation to give a koha, as part of shouldering one’s responsibility as whānau. In Māori circles, this is often a matter of pride. Destiny feels like a tribe of sorts — urban and slick. And it has its chief.
After the recent controversy, I asked my sister what she thought of it all. She told me:
“Most of us have come to God busted and disgusted, a menace to society, druggies, alcoholics, abusers of all sorts. And the longer we sit under the preached word, we learn and grow and develop a relationship with Jesus. Lots of people are now business owners, teachers, social workers, making a difference in society.”
As for Brian and Hannah Tamaki: “You know, he and Pastor Hannah are beautiful people. If there’s a celebration or tangi, Bishop is the first to go out hunting and Pastor Hannah bakes. They are always giving.”
Perhaps a Māori high school dropout from Te Awamutu with an alcoholic father is not meant to make it big on the national stage. Becoming wealthy and enjoying that wealth doesn’t fit the “brown box” image. Although Brian Tamaki started life on a similar track to his father, becoming a father as a teenager, he has risen above that beginning in life and done well for himself. And he’s still married to the mother of that child.
Tamaki has been cheap click-bait for some and a chance to gain virtue-signalling brownie points for others. As for the haters? The dark underbelly of New Zealand’s tall poppy syndrome means “haters gonna hate”. Certainly, Tamaki’s message is a perceived threat to the gay community, as it cuts to the core of their identity. But, if Destiny’s social media pages is any indication of what they’re really about, preaching against homosexuality is not what defines the church. As Peter Lineham has stated, their emphasis is on improving life for their Māori followers.
Brian Tamaki and supporters like Stan Walker, who spoke at a Destiny event last weekend, tell a similar story about fathers who failed, alcohol abuse, drug abuse, domestic violence and incarceration. Women tell of their husband’s lives being changed for the better. A daughter speaks of being re-united with a father she’d never met. The message is transformational.
The Man Up campaign, which Destiny is promoting, has a goal to reach out to Māori “brothers” and support them to become better fathers and husbands. The image of 700 Māori men standing outside Wiri prison, calling for a change to the lives of their incarcerated brothers, singing the hymn He Honore, He Korooria and performing the haka, sends a powerful message. No less the image of a group of men, some of them members of rival gangs, being baptised together and embracing. Powerful, indeed!
The fallout over Brian Tamaki’s message seems to be an example of how we can live in parallel universes in New Zealand. The call to strip Destiny of its charitable status is driven by the agenda of one sector of society against another. But the petition seems misguided given the good work Destiny achieves among it own people.
As an indigenous-led and directed movement, Destiny is working to achieve positive outcomes for Māori. It has an undeniable ability to reach struggling Māori with a message that is not only aspirational, but also transformational.
In the early 19th century, it was Māori, freed from the bondage of physical as well as spiritual slavery, who reached other Māori with a redemptive message. The Man Up movement of Māori men reaching other Māori men has historical precedent. The message — Raising fathers to save our children — is desperately needed in our communities.
Why would anyone want to interfere with that?
Sheree Trotter (Te Arawa) is a PhD History candidate at the University of Auckland.
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I stood on Lambton Quay and
I stood on Lambton Quay and watched the Enough is Enough rally stomp by, dressed in black with fists clenched like it was Nuremburg all over again. You’ll have a hard time convincing me.
According to reports Losing
According to reports Losing tax status was about not submitting financial information over an extended period of time, something everyone has to do when required by the IRD and other regulatory organisations.
Thanks for a great article ..
Thanks for a great article … I have know and appreciated (respect) the Tamaki’s for over 35 years — so far … I with others pray for the continuing growth and effectiveness of the Destiny Church in this, and into future generations . . .
I see a lot of wealthy
I see a lot of wealthy customers everyday flaunting there designer clothing, diamond rings etc predominantly Europeans, the minute Maori leader Tamaki’s enjoy there wealth all of a sudden a lot of people have this hatred towards them. Before they pastored Destiny Church they were already wealthy. The government takes 15% of my wages! And I have no choice to give to the government! With church, people have a choice to give of their tithes! Churches don’t live off power, water, facilities for free but by generous people who volunteer and give! I hope that people who have hate towards Bishop Brian that they take a good long look in the mirror and look at themselves before judging others. Thanks for this beautiful and well said article.
i have asked people who are
i have asked people who are part of the church and I am satisfied that everyone who is part of the church is looked after and have what they need no one is going without the basics. I think that is highly commendable.
Most of what is said in the
Most of what is said in the above article is true, but you must admit it was a stupid thing for him to say….And the Tamaki’s should stop flaunting their wealth it leave a bad taste in people’s mouths.
Who are we to judge Destiny
Who are we to judge Destiny Church and Brian Tamaki, that seat is already occupied by someone far greater than us. Continue you good work Destiny Church you are a blessing to others
I don’t go to Church, but I
I don’t go to Church, but I can’t help feel Brian tamaki should be prime minister.
Thank you for your wise words
Thank you for your wise words I have know Hannah and Brian since we were 11 years old. All that they do is the better of all people not just the maori but the higher percentage of their following are Maori or Pacific Islander. The media needs to stop storking them and let them get on with their wholesome work
I go with kym clifton. I know
I go with kym clifton. I know a family that was attending who didnt have much money but still kept giving as its in yr face to give.
Kia ora Sheree,
Kia ora Sheree,
Thank you for your insight I appreciate your words. My husband walked to Auckland from Napier 9 years ago with nothing but a bag of clothes. He walked into Destiny church and heard Bishop talking about fatherless sons and it hit home. After joining the Church and transforming his life of drugs, alcohol and violence I moved here with our two sons and baby girl. We got married, had another boy who is now four and we have made a decent life for our whanau. I am studying fulltime for a degree teaching in kura kaupapa and we are building a business with a cousin in mountain board riding. Our eldest son has been accepted to study at Waikato next year and all our children speak te Reo fluently. There are thousands of others like us as your sister has spoken about, that have turned their lives around. But it is only through our faith in God and Jesus Christ, Bishop’s revelatory preaching of God’s word and the guidance of the wairua tapu that we keep on track – we’re still a ‘work in progress’. Mā te Atua koe e manaaki i ngā wā katoa.
Lovely testimony thanks Delphine.
Freedom of speech. It is a
Freedom of speech. It is a well known fact,read the bible, that homosexuality is seen by christian followers as a sin. I have people who make judgement of me, its happens. Humans judge each other based on their personal beliefs. At least Brian Tamaki is willing to walk the talk. We live in a society where people are too scared to speak up against anything unjust,there is cheating in sport, stealing and murder everywhere. No one speaks up, Brian Tamaki has spoken up for what he beleives in, i may or may not agree but its great that someone in our wishy washy society has the guts to speak up anf stand by what they say. Suck it up folks listen to another persons ,you can take it or leave it.
Bravo!, the media owes the
Bravo!, the media owes the tamaki’s an opology, it’s not the first time they have gone after them and other Christians who speak out and contribute to the wellbeing of disadvantage people in our society. There are many other Christian organizations and churches who get tax breaks, and without them would not be able to function,and without them the people who they serve suffer. I believe it’s not really about the Tamaki’s but about the persecuted church as a whole.
the gay community has a lot
the gay community has a lot of influence in nz which enables its aggressive attacks on bishop tamaki and destiny church. the government has never truly supported anything maori and likely never will. with these two points in mind it shouldnt take a genius to figure out the reason behind the recent media attention on bishop brian and destiny church. stick to facts people. stay away from being the author of your own information….
I thought the article was
I thought the article was refreshing to read. It does not matter what church organization social group we attend the easiest thing is to be critical. Some are more practised in this skill. No group church political movement or indeed person is perfect. Sometimes perhaps acknowledge this fact and look for the good? Too simplistic? I would rather be simple than a cynic thinking the worst of people and things. A person is judged by their fruit at the end of the day?
kia ora
kia ora
My experience has been that there are very, very many prosperous pastors of churches here in Aotearoa- and so it should be as this is something that is promised in the scriptures. No one wants to follow the teachings of a pohara pastor who struggles day to day. You want to see the blessings that are promised fruiting in peoples lives. I, too, see the massive changes in whole whanau members miraculously being affected by their attendance at the Destiny church. You can’t make deny the fruit is good. Ka pai, koutou. Keep it up!!! My comment that they are being accused of being a ‘hate group’ is just stupid. How can you be accused of this when he is just sharing what is in the bible? On the other side, Maori have been targets of ‘hate groups’ all our lives. They’re called the media. Just read the newspapers to see how the headlines of negative reporting. And one of the worse hate groups against Maori was the government and their assimilation policies. They had the actual power to enact their ‘hate’ upon us by systematically robbing us of every advantage we had and we know the scenarios of land stealing, getting hit for speaking Maori at school. My message to all those attacking the Destiny Church. “Get over it! We had to…
When you say “no one wants to
When you say “no one wants to follow the teachings of a pohara pastor”? Weren’t Jesus and all of his disciples poor? They had abandoned worldly goods and possessions. Proverbs 11:28 -“He who trusts in his riches will fall, But the righteous will flourish like the green leaf.” Your comment reminds me of the Warning against the Scribes (Luke 20:45-47) In His teaching Jesus also said, “Watch out for the scribes. They like to walk around in long robes, to receive greetings in the marketplaces, and to have the chief seats in the synagogues and the places of honour at banquets. They defraud widows of their houses, and for a show make lengthy prayers. These men will receive greater condemnation.” Then (Luke 21:1-4) As Jesus was sitting opposite the treasury, He watched the crowd placing money into it. And many rich people put in large amounts. Then one poor widow came and put in two small copper coins, which amounted to a small fraction of a denarius. Jesus called His disciples to Him and said, “Truly I tell you, this poor widow has put more than all the others into the treasury. For they all contributed out of their surplus, but she out of her poverty has put in all she had to live on.”
(Ephesians 6:5-9) Of course, godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into the world, and neither can we carry anything out of it. But if we have food and clothing, we will be content with these. Those who want to be rich, however, fall into temptation and become ensnared by many foolish and harmful desires that plunge them into ruin and destruction. 1For the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil. By craving it, some have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many sorrows. And of course the most famous of them all – Mark 10:25 “It is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”
Using your logic, wouldn’t we all have to follow the Pope? I just don’t see how getting money of your flock, then spending it on yourself to look “successful” is, in fact, a sign of “success” whatever that means.
Thank you Sheree for such a
Thank you Sheree for such a refreshing article on the Destiny Church and its leaders. I knew them back in the days when they pastored the Rotorua Apostolic Church. Their charisma and genuine love for others saw their congregation grow faster than any other congregation in the Apostolic Movement. Brian was ahead of his time in pushing for equal recognition for women in ministry and Hannah led worship and wrote worship in a way that could only be described as anointed. While, as a Christian I agree with much of what Brian has said, I have felt very uncomfortable with HOW he has said it – or should that be – with how it has been reported that he has said it? Thank you for bringing balance to the discussion.
I went to Destiny Church some
I went to Destiny Church some years ago and was absolutely disgusted. It was my first attendance and went with an open mind. The congregation were not wealthy but, the underlying message from the paster (Brian) was give, give, give. Direct debit forms were placed at the back and he made sure to mention that on a regular basis. To me, a number of people who attended looked like they were finding it hard to make ends meet, while Hannah (Brian’s wife) walked up the aisle dripping in gold bracelets (literally). Let’s face it, if you are fleecing the congregation you don’t rub it in their noses. I have no time for this church what so ever.
No one is perfect. No one is
No one is perfect. No one is perfectly bad. Thanks for the theme of this article, which talks about applying to Brian Tamaki and the Destiny church the same standards of acceptance and compassion that we want from him. I agree. It’s too easy to let anger beget more anger. Better (but much harder) to love your enemy. Thanks Sheree.
How much does Tamaki
How much does Tamaki personally take from his church? Anyone know?
Tena koe Miranda despite the
Tena koe Miranda despite the obviously great mahi that has been done through the ministry of BBT you still feel the need to know about his financial status
Let me ask you this how much do you make? If it makes you feel uncomfortable then can you imagine how others may feel
I do attend Destiny Church and have done since 1990 and in that time til this day I haven’t once been forced to give and while we’re at it as Sheree has put it there are other ministers making a great deal more than BBT however BBT convictions and love for God are more standout than maybe perhaps other ministers.
Man Up is a program that us currently for men in this nation not just Maori but for all men it has seen some transformational changes for our men from all walks of lives ranging from gangs to irresponsible father’s who’ve made choices that are irresponsible but are now manning up to their responsibility as father’s and most certainly husbands partners.
The government is filling our prisons and Man Up is emptying them surely that alone is something to be happy grateful and proud of.
All this run by volunteers of Destiny Church who voluntarily run the programs in our communities and funded by us the people of Destiny Church not because we want to be seen as the top of the list but because we sincerely want to see our communities thrive.
Ignorance is only that because we fail to inform ourselves but would rather hear second hand that BBT earns his putea off my back you couldn’t more far from the truth is I invite you to attend a Destiny Church near you to get the actual truth and not another’s perception of what they think the truth is so it is old and stale korero about my Bishops finance
BTW the government funds programs that are in my view haven’t been as successful as the Man Up program
Thank you Sheree for your thesis very inspiring to know that you’ve once held your opinion about my hahi and have seen how it has and still continues to evolve
Good balanced article here.
Good balanced article here.
While I do think Tamaki is in this “I prophesied the earthquake” claim being an utter tool and so deserves most of the c**p being dumped on him I don’t think him evil by any means & Destiny does do more good in the community than most churches (but also more bad & it’s the more bad the Bishop does gets the news)
An overwhelming majority of the c**p thrown at him however seems to come from those having a cheap punch at the target-of-the-day to make themselves feel superior and not from the LGBTI Communities. Probably same type of people who a few years ago would have been having a go at the Gays & Lesbians (using less publishable words)
thanks for the article and my
thanks for the article and my reflections on decolonization……………there are many examples and stories of land sea and storm related to indigenous beliefs…………….they have value and did not arrive just recently……………like the rain man and his powers within American Indian culture and also the myth about throwing plum seeds in to the sea will bring about wind and storm,these can be philosophical in thought also…………….last week it was pretty scary to make a comment for all the haters on fb for our fellow human Brian Tamaki……………kia kaha love the opportunity today to reflect……………….today
Response to Bishop Tamaki and
Response to Bishop Tamaki and the media coverage of his comments:
Many friends and family wanted my thoughts on what Brian Tamaki said during his sermon last Sunday that was broadcast on several media outlets on Wednesday.
Thanks to David Sega I was able to watch the whole service so as to ensure I did not take his comments out of context. That’s the last thing I wanted to do.
Here is my brief response. Those who want to have more discussion on this please PM me. I am happy to engage with whoever would like to.
1. Tamaki used a passage in Leviticus to say that the earth speaks under the bondage of mans sins because the earth was never meant to carry our sin. It speaks through earth quakes and volcanic eruptions etc.
There is no such passage in the book of Leviticus that says that. I assume he is misquoting Leviticus 18:24-25 which says that God would cast (vomitteth out) the Canaanites from the land because of their sexual sin. We know that God did this at the hands of the Israelites by war. He also told Israel to not do what they (the pagan nations) had done. There is absolutely no reference to earthquakes or eruptions, this is a misinterpretation of the text. What we call Eisogesis, putting something into the bible that isn’t there. Something many preachers do and all the more reason Christians need to learn to study the scriptures.
2. Tamaki was referring to the Christchurch quakes not the ones that just took place on late Sunday evening in Kaikoura.
Remember the sermon he preached was on SunDAY so it was before the actual earthquakes that have recently happened.
While some in his congregation may try to scream prophecy if you listen to the sermon he wasn’t referring to the recent ones but the ones of a few years ago. He also made mention of some in a Years time as a warning,not any that would happen that evening.
It was bad timing for Bishop because many got hold of the sermon and in light of recent earthquakes made the connection. Those who are trying to say it was a prophetic word need a slap for being so ignorant.
3. Tamaki has made out that the earthquakes in Christchurch that took so many lives are because of people’s sins or the sin of the city.
This could not be further from the truth. Jesus refutes this idea several times in the New Testament. While God can cause specific things to take place in the world, natural disasters etc are part and parcel of the world we live in. They are a reminder to us that the world is decaying and it is not getting any better. Praise the Lord we have a new world to look forward to if we know Jesus as our Saviour.
I would like to appeal:
– to all Christians to obey 2 Timothy 2:15 and study the word in order to be able to divide it correctly. You cannot just take what a preacher says as being from God. You have to examine the Word yourself and make sure it is accurate. Look for a church where the pastor preaches the text of scripture not where a man just stands up for a long period of time sharing his own thoughts.
– to all my friends and family that are not Christians or in church. What Tamaki said is not supported nor a reflection of what we believe as Christians. Please do not think it is and put all of us Christians in the same boat.
– to those who were directly affected by the current earth quakes or the Christchurch ones of a few years ago. What Tamaki said was way out of line and I want you to know we share in this burden with you and pray God will comfort and give you the strength to get through.
Kia Ora family and friends.
Hope this response is helpful,
Pastor Cliff
Js like to add dat Destiny
Js like to add dat Destiny Church is not js based on Maori ppl alone Destiny Church contains and is about a Counter Culture the church contains all racez Maori Islanderz Pakeha etc
In response to comment #2 –
In response to comment #2 – you are certainly not alone in your views that the church propagates hate speech. I find it an unacceptable representation of the gospel of peace that bible-believing Christians hold to and share. Although people are entitled to their opinions I fear that Christians are being bullied more regularly into either recanting on their beliefs of what the bible says or being burnt at the social-media stake. To suggest that the Bible is responsible for causing young people to commit suicide is another unfortunate conclusion promoted regularly. How ironic that tolerance has become so intolerant.
just a thought on
just a thought on decolonization………….recently after hearing all Tamaki comments come under the radar,it is visible conversation on some indigenous channels and networks……….where that spiritual influence is commonplace with its own unique perspectives……..like plum seeds thrown into the sea cause storms,some indian beliefs related to the rainman and his powers,actually I did not comment on the pages which were full of hate for Tamaki several weeks ago it was scary to try and get a word in if it looked like advocacy and debate so thanks for the article today.
Tena koe Sheree,
Tena koe Sheree,
I couldn’t have put it any better I totally agree I am a pastor from Panmure Bishop Brian has my respect why? Because he dares to make a difference in peoples lives and especially our people. Like you I don’t know how much money he makes but I know that if he wasn’t making a difference in peoples lives they wouldn’t be there eg Man Up. Thanks for that awesome article.
“And it has obscured what
“And it has obscured what Destiny is really about — an indigenous-led church that’s helping Māori families turn their lives around.”
“For many Māori, Destiny Church feels culturally comfortable. The vibe is Māori-friendly.”
Are our takatāpui no longer part of the whānau? I suggest to the writer that she do more research into the effects of hate speech upon our young people. As a youth worker, young people I have worked with have killed themselves, and self-harmed for reasons similar to this – in a ‘the straw that broke the camel’s back’, kind of way .
An indigenous-led church, pushing a colonial message is no friend to us.
And the testimonials of two cis gay men are not CLOSE to representative of the wider takatāpui community.
Kia ora Sheree
Kia ora Sheree
Thank you for your words. I share a similar view although I thought that perhaps his communications advice could have assisted in managing public perception a little more wisely. When you put your words into the internet space, you are up for public scrutiny, which is not kind. When Tamaki started a Destiny church in Whanganui a number of years ago, church and Maori leaders offered to powhiri them to the city. The Destiny movement turned them down which was a shame because there was a lot of genuine goodwill. Like you, a number of Whanganui leadership acknowledged the work that Destiny had achieved to date amongst Maori in a manner unprecedented by other churches and it was hoped the same could occur. Unfortunately the Destiny church in Whanganui didn’t last. But that doesn’t take away from it being a movement that has brought positive change for many 21st century grassroots Maori.